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 Lights and Fog 
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Joined: Wed Nov 30, 2005 9:26 pm
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Post Lights and Fog
I would like to get the opinion of those that attend concerts regularly about things that enhance a show. Mainly, lighting and fog. I am trying to trim some costs from show budgets and to supplement lights at Ground Zero costs extra to rent. Is it worth it? I feel it all depends on the ticket price and band. However, I was at a show at Club Underground last year and hated the fact that they only had one can even though I only paid $5 to get in. Triple Rock won't allow fog anymore and I LOVE to see fog with dark electro. Does it matter?
I recall someone complaining at our first De.Vision show in 2007 that they thought the lighting sucked for the ticket price so we have been adding more and more but the base cost for that has been $150 up to $500 for Lords of Acid. Ground Zero has added more lighting but my main question is "Is house lighting sufficient for a $12 ticket show?" Triple Rock does it all the time.


Thu Nov 04, 2010 8:15 am
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Post Re: Lights and Fog
Fog is a joke. Why anyone uses this annoying crap anymore puzzles me. It stinks and looks stupid.

As for lights, a lot can be done with a small amount of them if the "lighting tech" knows what they're doing.
I don't even think about lights at all when going to a show unless there is a dedicated and excellent light show as part of the bill.


Thu Nov 04, 2010 9:43 am
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Post Re: Lights and Fog
zom-zom wrote:
Fog is a joke. Why anyone uses this annoying crap anymore puzzles me. It stinks and looks stupid.


Unter Null had almost as much fog as Sisters of Mercy and it didn't stink a bit. I asked them what they used and I forgot what they told me but I think it was water based.


Thu Nov 04, 2010 11:15 am
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Post Re: Lights and Fog
Still.. what does one like about fog? Do you like to pretend you're in a post-apocalypse world of burning waste?

I think it just looks dumb.


Thu Nov 04, 2010 11:28 am
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Post Re: Lights and Fog
I can remember going to see Slayer on the "South of Heaven" tour and they had a fog machine that came from under the sound board and up through the back of the crowd
It smelled of amonia and was just unpleasant enough to set the mood for the rest of the show

I could go either way with fog and lights
Now if someone could just to something about the sheer nuber of boring and tediously un-original bands that infest the club scene right now

I'm not paying to see fog and lights, I'm paying to see content
Judging by the talent on most bills nowadays, I am in the minority

Speaking of providing content
When are you gonna book PyroPlasticFlow?

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Thu Nov 04, 2010 12:48 pm
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Post Re: Lights and Fog
you need particulates in the air in order to see lasers, hence fog. i like the stuff mach fox had that smelled like maple syrup.

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Thu Nov 04, 2010 3:45 pm
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Post Re: Lights and Fog
I've seen more fog-based shows sans lasers than with added retina-burning effects.


Thu Nov 04, 2010 3:57 pm
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Post Re: Lights and Fog
I generally think fog is a waste UNLESS there are wicked awesome lights to go with it; not just cans, but arrays of synchronized kinetic projectors. Most of the shows I've seen where the lighting wowed me were more techno "bands" (Orbital? Chemical Bros? my memory's a bit hazy, no pun intended). I don't think the goth/industrial/darksider crowd has expectations that high, though.

GZ recently supplemented their lighting system (pretty significantly!), so you should probably check that out before spending any money on renting stuff above&beyond that.


Remember before the smoking ban, when a fog machine wasn't even needed? Uhh yeah, you won't hear me complaining about fog smell very often. My clothes never reek of fog a week later!


Thu Nov 04, 2010 4:56 pm
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Post Re: Lights and Fog
Look, it basically comes down to this, as far as I'm concerned;

When I attend a show and the place suddenly becomes engulfed in "fog" and then the band starts playing, I always ask, "Why the hell are they pumping so much goddamn fog through here?!" Then I actually listen to the music and realize, "Oh, that's why."

'Nuff said.


Thu Nov 04, 2010 7:49 pm
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Post Re: Lights and Fog
Shows are fine without fog and lights. Honestly sometimes the lights are overboard. If its a good act I would be happy if there was just one incandescent bulb.


Fri Nov 05, 2010 7:37 pm
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Post Re: Lights and Fog
Most of the shows zom-zom's attended have been by candlelight.

/ohsnap #anotheroldmanjoke


Fri Nov 05, 2010 9:19 pm
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Post Re: Lights and Fog
rskm1 wrote:
I don't think the goth/industrial/darksider crowd has expectations that high, though.

GZ recently supplemented their lighting system (pretty significantly!), so you should probably check that out before spending any money on renting stuff above&beyond that.



I just had a chat with MARK about that. Should save some money this way!!

I always have negative comments in the back of my mind and I remember someone saying from De.Vision in 2007 that they thought for the money there should have been more lights. Granted, I know someone is always going to bitch but I aim to please.


Fri Nov 05, 2010 11:07 pm
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Post Re: Lights and Fog
rskm1 wrote:
Most of the shows zom-zom's attended have been by candlelight.

/ohsnap #anotheroldmanjoke


Uh, that would have been Limelight.

Know your eras before attempting historically-based humour.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Limelight


Sun Nov 07, 2010 7:21 am
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Post Re: Lights and Fog
I prefer Limelight. A fantastic film.


Sun Nov 07, 2010 11:30 am
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Post Re: Lights and Fog
i prefer the moonlight. the serious moonlight.

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Sun Nov 07, 2010 2:29 pm
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Post Re: Lights and Fog
As a girl with asthma, I freaking hate smoke machines. And pretty much nobody has as much fog as SoM did. that was such a disappointing evening.


Thu Nov 11, 2010 8:07 pm
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Post Re: Lights and Fog
to me, fog is kind annoying unless it seems to cover the entire floor of the stage (but to do that, it would likely take multiple fog points to disperse the fog evenly). frequently, it just ends up obscuring one's view of the show. i personally think, that if fog is used, you should still be able to see what's going on for the most part.
lighting really depends on the type of show as different lighting seems to work better with different types of music. for the most part, i think lighting in most places is fine. as long as i can see the show, i'm happy. so the only lighting i don't much care for is the bright blinding strobe lights. if i could, i'd break every damn one of those things. i don't like bright light (or even sunlight for that matter) to begin with because my eyes are sensitive to it, and i always groan to myself when i see such things on a stage.


Mon Nov 15, 2010 5:37 am
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Post Re: Lights and Fog
I was working at MARS music one day and got the idea to combine a smoke machine and a bubble machine
You shoot a short burst of smoke into the intake fan of the bubble machine
The end result is smoke filled bubbles
It is particularly cool when the bubble bursts and the smoke spreads out

How come no one ever uses dry ice fog anymore?

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Mon Nov 15, 2010 12:41 pm
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Post Re: Lights and Fog
Rockula! wrote:
How come no one ever uses dry ice fog anymore?


Because people are lazy. You have to go get dry ice and set up a dispersion system. Fog machines are stupid easy. Pour in the fog juice and turn it on.


Mon Nov 15, 2010 12:59 pm
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Post Re: Lights and Fog
smoke-filled bubbles! what a great idea...


Tue Nov 16, 2010 7:02 am
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Post Re: Lights and Fog
seasonfire wrote:
smoke-filled bubbles! what a great idea...


They're available and not very expensive:


http://www.htfr.com/more-info/USD/MR203546


Tue Nov 16, 2010 9:02 am
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Post Re: Lights and Fog
skywayman wrote:
Rockula! wrote:
How come no one ever uses dry ice fog anymore?


Because people are lazy. You have to go get dry ice and set up a dispersion system. Fog machines are stupid easy. Pour in the fog juice and turn it on.



It is easy
Get a decent sized bucket or med sized trash can with a lid
Cut a hole in the lid
Stick a hose in it
pour in the water and drop the dry ice
Whammo!
fog that hugs the stage

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Tue Nov 16, 2010 4:15 pm
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Post Re: Lights and Fog
That's still harder than fog juice, turn on. Also you can buy fog juice just about anywhere. Dry iced not so much. But I agree, the effect is far better.


Wed Nov 17, 2010 10:29 pm
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Post Re: Lights and Fog
Go to any bait shop or Wal mart (in the bait shop of the wal mart)
I'm sure there are tons of places to find it

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Thu Nov 18, 2010 2:08 pm
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Post Re: Lights and Fog
I always ask the sound guy to put more Fog in the mix... the least they can do when there is only one DI, and no working subs.

Not every genre/band needs fog and lasers.

Fog can be used to enhance lights and create an aesthetic...
more shows could use proper lighting and fog.
-and by proper I mean not filling entire room...which I may have done mostly becuz people cry sooo much about fog.

It seriously is way better than retard sticks.


Sat Nov 20, 2010 2:17 pm
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Post Re: Lights and Fog
I've heard about being hit with an ugly stick
But a retard stick?

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Sat Nov 20, 2010 4:53 pm
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Post Re: Lights and Fog
I really dislike fog. Unter Null had way too much, IMO. I like to see the band.

I don't really pay attention to the lighting. The last time The Dreaming played at The Rock, to use an example, they had predominantly just red lights. Their stage show is extremely energetic. They don't need a light show, but they have 5 guys and all but the drummer are all over the stage the whole set.

See example (no enhancements to the photo, just a plain ole shot without flash):

http://www.aztalanturf.com/images/chris-hall.jpg

Now let's say Assemblage 23 played at GZ, to use an example of your typical synth setup. Would additional lights enhance the show? Maybe but only if there's something really special going on that would likely be way out of GZ's or your price range. I still think the house lights would be sufficient. A projector / screen with a nifty video (ala IAMX or Celldweller) would enhance a show for someone like A23 moreso than additional lighting, IMO, and a video show would be something the band would have to bring themselves.

Here's an example clip from Garbage's 2005 show at First Ave:

http://vimeo.com/3228213

I quite liked the lighting and screens, especially during Sex Is Not The Enemy. Unfortunately, I don't have video clips for that. But they used the screens to display pairings of gendered words that have different connotations whether they're used for males or females. E.g. stud / slut. But again, not something a venue or promoter could provide.

So basically, I don't notice the lighting unless the lighting is 1. Really cool (ala NIN or Garbage) or 2. Distracting.

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Sun Nov 28, 2010 11:11 pm
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Post Re: Lights and Fog
Did some research for an event coming up and here's what I found
10 pounds of dry ice = $10
10 pounds of dry ice = 15 minutes of fog

so, a 45 minute set will cost you roughly $40/45 in dry ice
The application itself is very simple
5 gallon buckets of hot water and a fan
The cost is just waay too much
Unless you are KISS or something and buy it by the bulk

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Mon Jan 10, 2011 8:27 pm
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Post Re: Lights and Fog
Rockula! wrote:
so, a 45 minute set will cost you roughly $40/45 in dry ice


Damn. So fog juice it is!


Mon Jan 10, 2011 10:09 pm
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Post Re: Lights and Fog
House lighting is just fine, especially at GZ.
I like fog. Sometimes it gives the illusion of a full floor of people.
It's cool dancing in fog anyway.


Tue Jan 18, 2011 9:42 pm
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